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  • Labyrinth, still interested?

    Hi guys,

    I like to push more for Laby concern... ik it sound useless and here i am again... sorry... but i'm still hoping for improvements... hope the mods/admins would read this, and push on.

    So, i was browsing some topic in Reddit earlier and can't help myself, need to share this simple conversation... (no offense to the people involved).. In here, shows someone liking Lab maybe for some few tries... then lost interest already.. (same as me)

    and another says..LUSHEN IT ON NORMAL to get em daily drops ! .. well, not a bad idea.. at least to simply get freebies... ik ik, the drops are good(sometimes) ... BUT, is this the kind of content we like to see for the entire duration of our SW gaming? normal it .. this really sounds like a failed content!




    Let's do a review again, checking the other PVP contents...

    CAIROS - Good content... here we grind all day to get em legendary (myth) runes haha... very old content from start, but still good and accepted till now for veterans... newbies still challenge themselves to go B1 to B10.

    TOA/H - Good, Very good if i may say... Both new players/mid to late do this.. no skipping.. we even build specific units to conquer till 100. Good source of freebies too

    WOLD BOSS - I feel is just a filler content, on auto, not superb in terms of enjoyment, but we still do it, all or most of us, becasue at the end after defeating wold boss, everyone get em goodies for participating. And sometimes will give a surprise LS or LnD and Devils, nivr right?!

    RAID - Yup, this PVE content is good too.. i challenge myself to do better here.. is hard but rewarding. not for early game, but new players shows interested to work their way up from 1,2,3,4 till R5

    RIFT - hell yeah, i like this too.. i hope u guys like it too i mean, here, we have a target, a mission! ... to get new character homie.. get crystals for weekl;y reapps stone.

    now.. Laby...

    LABYRINTH - ?? .... LUSHEN IT ON NORMAL to get em daily drops ! .... that's it? ... oh yeah i forgot, after guild BEAT the final boss, then they have the reward box.... oh...

    Let's take my guild for an example.. it's the 6th day and we only got 1 guardian... before, we already got em all 3 guardian on the 4th or 5th day

    I WONDER WHY? maybe coz maybe half of the guildy including myself lost interest... ik ik, it's our problem.. maybe... maybe not.. maybe there's this idea that 70.. 80.. or maybe 90% of the players lost interest to even try to finish the TARTAR boss.

    ------------------------

    TLDR; All other PVE contents are acceptable and still fun / challenging to do. For laby, some or most of us are forced to just do daily for daily reward. Some even lost interest to even participate. Hope we get some update, modification for laby. Thanks

    other reference:
    Laby suggestions from community
    https://forum.com2us.com/forum/main-...from-community

    DEVS pls wake up.. let's improve Laby pls !!!


  • #2
    I do it because I try to make the best out of a bad situation, but if I don't succeed on 1st attempts I second guess why I'm wasting the time and energy at all.

    I'm now 1 of only 2 guild members left that bothers to do any stage or boss on Hell mode, and my last 12 hell clears were blue or purple flat stat grinds/gems. I can't decide whether to laugh or cry after every victory.

    If avoiding lab entirely wasn't letting down guild members that were actually trying, then I probably would ignore it completely.

    The mechanics are dumb. The punishment for vio runes is dumb. The rewards are weak - I haven't kept a single drop in 2 weeks ... and the end rewards are pointless if you cant get an S box.

    When it comes to bosses : It's overtuned, filled with gamebreaking mechanics, and you can't auto them... so why manual for 2-3 minutes on normal for a tiny chance at something usable - let alone manual on hell for 5+ minutes hoping RNG doesn't cause you to fail - when you can auto b10s and R5 in 1-2 minutes (which wont fail to RNG) as much as you want?
    Last edited by Qbert; 09-10-2018, 09:50 AM.

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    • #3
      Honestly for me/my guild the only reason that the Laby is getting done at all is because they forced us to for this guild event. I guarantee that once this event is over our participation will drop right off. I've been trying for the good drop, but that is starting to look like few and far between as well. I'm sorry, but this is just another part of the game that is dominated by RNG and will eventually make more players give up. I hope I am wrong, I really do, because for some reason I keep finding the strength to push on and try to improve my units. This won't be the case for some though.

      Comment


      • BigDaddyToe
        BigDaddyToe commented
        Editing a comment
        even if we push the guildy, can only do som much to remind them.. will not kick em just because they are not interested in Laby.

        past experience, when laby was new and interesting, we can find the 3 guardian in 3 to 4 days... now it's on 6th day.. only found 1... not becasue is hard to find em.. coz few guildies only interested... sad, but that's our guild current situation

    • #4
      unpopular opinion BUUUUTTTTTT........ i actually like lab, people are so accustomed to autoing everything in this game that the min it requires attention, its automatically a "bad game mode" RTA, LAB, Siege, and so on...

      back in my days, we play games to actually play games to play the game and gain the experience/strats to beat the certain stage. i remember spending all day smashing the buttons just to clear 1 stage, the rush of getting close but not quite crossing the line, the accomplishment when you actually do. these are the reason i play.

      i see lab and rta the same way, these parts of the game actually requires strats, requires your focus and not just "lol cheese it mode" people complain that the game is stale and boring, c2u introduces new mechanic and game play, suddenly "its game breaking and dumb" i mean come on, you either cheese everything, auto it to death and it becomes "stale and boring" or you have "game breaking mechanic that needs nerf until its cheese everything and auto it to death so it becomes stale and boring"

      people get mad because they cant beat hell, goes back to overestimating themself, under delivering and then getting mad that the game is "broken" see it in arena, see it in rta, see it in guild wars and honestly, people have such high expectation of themself that the min they cant beat a game mode, suddenly it needs to be nerf... have you idk.. try a weaker setting???

      Comment


      • *Chow*
        *Chow* commented
        Editing a comment
        zahag you for get lab doesnt drop 2 summon stones for the cost of 8/9 energy.. you forget laby doesnt drop 10 unknown scrolls for 8 energy... so to say its the least profitable if laughable. it gives you 100% chance at a rune/grindstone, no other mode in the game gives you that...

      • zahag
        zahag commented
        Editing a comment
        It's why i said "slightly simplified"...
        But this argument doesn't change a lot.
        For runes we are so far from profitability. Even with a double "clear reward" i won't go.
        And for Grind/Gem i'll think about when i ll be able to do the stage with a minimum of 95% success, in full auto and in hell mode.
        This game is designed for "farmers", you have to look for efficiency otherwise you'll never have the time to evolve well.

      • *Chow*
        *Chow* commented
        Editing a comment
        zahag "efficiency" lets see whats more efficient, running db10 3 times in 3 min for 21 energy cost for a CHANCE at a rune, or..... run lab for 3 min at 10 energy cost for a GUARANTEED rune?

    • #5
      I dont care anymore about Lab. Built some Monsters to do It, but the completation reward demotivated me. Also, im doing normal stages, got sick after losing my time on hell to get 5* runes and see dozens of legendary gems on normal mode.

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      • BigDaddyToe
        BigDaddyToe commented
        Editing a comment
        same here, there are times, i dont even remember doing it, or dont want to

        And this is the reason, why i like to push more to see if we can awaken the sleeping devs to work on some improvements thanks for sharing your experience.

    • #6
      Simple solution, REMOVE THE ENERGY COST.
      the rewards are far and away not worth 10 energy for every failed attempt on anything higher than normal mode.
      we are already limited to 3 lanterns per day. it really has no need to cost energy. This would perhaps draw in those, like myself who have lost all interest in lab to try teams and comps.

      Comment


      • BigDaddyToe
        BigDaddyToe commented
        Editing a comment
        Well, not entirely free. We cab trim down depending on mode..
        maybe 5 for normal. 7 or 8 on hard, then 10 ene on hell

    • #7
      I dont particularly enjoy it but I do it hoping to get a good grindstone or enchant gem. Lab in a way if you look at it is just one extra energy than R5 so it doesn't make much of a difference in attempting to get stones.

      I still do normal and rarely attempt hard unless its a one clear deal.

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      • #8
        I agree with you BigD that lab does need some changes for sure. Yet, I also agree with Chow that those changes should *not* be to make lab an auto-cakewalk cheesefest. For my part I enjoy the strategy required for lab; building different comps for the different types of cells.. I wish there was a reason to push for harder difficulty clears, but the crappy RNG on drops provides none. I also wish I had a reason to build comps for bosses, but being in a small guild I don't bother because we'll never finish in time with the current clearing requirements.

        And that's one problem - small guilds or those with lesser participation have no incentive to try finishing. Guilds should need to declare the number of eligible players for lab to establish 10 & 20-member brackets, and the 10 member bracket should be strictly enforced to *exactly 10* to prevent people from cheesing the system like they do in normal guild war (which allows up to 15). Needless to say I wish they'd make the cutoff strictly 10 members in normal guild war but that's another topic entirely.. So, lab *needs* scaling the same way as guild war. Then guildmasters can gauge their guild size and/or participation level to set an obtainable final clearing goal; thus providing members incentive to do lab (yes ik drops stink; see below lol).

        I think the biggest problem with lab - and what causes people to not care - is far too much RNG in daily drops, and staggeringly too much for the final clear. Initially I did lab on hard, but quickly quit bothering because normal gives basically the same drops.. It's the equivalent of allowing nearly the same drops from GB1 vs 10 or the amounts and types of essences in b1 vs b10 of elemental dungeons, etc. This is ridiculous! I mean - sure I'm glad to (at times) get decent drops out of normal lab - yet this isn't fair to people who clear hard or hell, nor does this situation give people much reason for doing anything other than auto-fast normal runs (if even that)..

        For cryin out loud c2u if you're going to make very hard endgame content then reward the people clearing it accordingly! Give em a reason to push for clearing harder difficulty with a more cairos-like tiered b1 to 10 drop system, instead of the current situation of little difference between normal to hell difficulty. Lab isn't like dungeons or raids where people can endlessly run them for as long as they have crystal for refills (which does, in fact, *require* a punishingly low drop chance like it is); lab is 3 times a day maximum with a drop box for a final clear. Imagine if people could only run gb-db-nb10 or raids 3x a day with the current low drop RNG.. Need I say more? Lol!

        Tl;dr
        - make lab strictly enforced 10 & 20 member declared rosters same as guild war to accomodate for guild size & participation level
        - change daily drops to a more cairos-like tiered system based on difficulty (normal, hard, hell)
        - vastly improve the final clear drop boxes and make them scaled more appropriately than they are currently.

        Above all, cutting the low end of RNG out of higher clear levels (normal vs hard vs hell) and especially final clear letter grades is critical!! Lab *is not* farmable the way cairos and raids are - it's very limited, and thus the usual low-RNG rates are inappropriate.

        These are the reasons I see (from a mid-gamer perspective) why interest in lab has waned. I hope com2us considers *any* of the ideas put forth here or in the original post BigDaddyToe made to improve labyrinth. Thx again BigD for persisting in bringing this lab topic up

        Comment


        • Azombiebaby
          Azombiebaby commented
          Editing a comment
          I do like your idea to enforce a set amount of members to do Lab, since for me we have a select few who can do hard/hell but then half the guild who can MAYBE do a single normal stage and so it's impossible to clear.

      • #9
        After I started getting 4* rune drops I gave up completely. No long explanation, I like the lab but over half the guild gave up/can't do it and I've seen the quality of rewards people are getting for clearing it fast so I can imagine how bad they'd be for clearing it slow xD

        Also I hate that there's no notification to tell you when it's finished/restarted. Makes it not feel like a proper part of the game.

        Edit: In regards to some comments I see, I don't see anywhere where people are saying to make the whole lab easier.. Sure I think Normal needs to not be the late-mid game stage but hard/hell seem fine in difficulty. I'm definitely not end game and I'm happy not doing Hell, I can just about do Hard with a strategy and that's the bit I enjoy.

        There are some good suggestions I'm seeing we can only hope that C2U listens to some of them, maybe alters them slightly as to not make Lab brokenly easy.
        Last edited by Azombiebaby; 09-10-2018, 01:07 PM.

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        • #10
          Bottom line....I can see that the vast majority of players have an issue with Lab in one way or another. I think what people are really having an issue with is that it feels like Com2us isn't worried about tweaking any further. It still seems like content that is in the planning phase, like it hasn't been fully thought out all that well. I'm hoping they( the devs ) read threads like this and understand that these suggestions aren't being made because we HATE their game, but because we LOVE this game and would like to keep playing for a long time coming.

          Comment


          • BigDaddyToe
            BigDaddyToe commented
            Editing a comment
            one step at a time..

            we suggest.. we shout out...

            mods/admin pass over the suggestions and concern...

            then hope devs hear it load and clear... even if they hear it already.. still take time to plan and do changes.

            Good part, we already shout out, mods/admins hear it and some already pass on according to a mod...

            now we wait and hope for the best!

        • #11
          Since day 1 I found lab not fun.

          I am one to like challenge and manual. I never farmed arena, used all my sword in GS and enjoy that. Love RTA.

          I think my guild of 20 active players have used 100 lanterns since the beginning of the event so really not that much. I hate the bosses mechanic. there are really no strategy. Either you try to bruise it at a level lower than yours and pray for RNG not to screw you up. Or you just nuke the boss as fast as you can before RNG can screw you up.

          The rewards are a joke and not worth the effort.

          If they want people to participate to Lab, c2u need to give real rewards, similar to TOA. Clear hell stage, get legend stone. Clear hard get hero, clear normal get rare.

          Clear S rank, guaranty 6-6* legend runes
          Clear A rank, guaranty 6-6* hero runes or 3 6* legend
          Clear B rank, guaranty 6-6 rare runes or 1 6* legend.
          Or whatever else they can think of. Devilmon, legendary scrolls, massive amount of xtals, etc. But the rewards must be 100% of a known type. Otherwise why bother with something that is slow and so dependant on RNG.

          c2u, just look at the data from TOAH. How many people stop at a stage and don't try any higher? All my friend pretty much make sure they get to the devil, then continue to try hard to reach 80 for the xtals then they stop as soon as they loose once. RNG rewards are just not fun and not worth time/energy/frustration. Myself, I auto to ~85 then don't bother going any higher.

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          • #12
            Its a lost cause. The reward rates are abysmal, it needs team effort, costs more than a single dungeon run.

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            • #13
              I have more or less lost interest...just one more chore to chase after. Half the time I forget it is even there because I'm in Cairos rune farming all day. I'm still getting used to accepting the check in reward from guild.

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              • #14
                I can manually everythin on Hell.
                Those "immemorial" things are just a myth and btw, no one cares at all.
                Just saying is useless, now I auto everything on normal/hard and done. Rewards sometimes are ok/good, most of the time are trash, like on hell mode.

                So, why to bother?

                C2u seems to love to release stuff with 0% appeal and 100% greed. Like you can break the game with the amazing prizes...
                Last edited by Sparkstein; 09-11-2018, 10:30 AM.

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                • #15
                  I'm just doing it in "S" days because the runes are quite good, below that I'd stopped. And of course we've finished the event requirements so we felt no needs on doing it further. </3

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